Church Shootings

[Lamron]

Two church shootings in Colorado today.
tinyurl.com/26em63

This is why you should always be armed at church! I know of several other people in my church that are armed and we all try to keep an eye out for trouble on Sunday morning.

Its easy to get complacent and people want to believe that church is a "safe" place, but its actually one of the the places you are most likely to be a victim of violence. You always have a chance of random attack on any day/place, but the statistical likelihood is usually pretty low. But a church can attract trouble from those who object to the teaching, people who feel they've been wronged by church members, ex-husbands trying to find their wives, parents who think the church "stole" their children, domestic terrorists looking for an "easy" target, etc. etc.

If you are carrying a gun at church, try to find like-minded individuals that are doing so also, so you know each other and can coordinate things like sitting seperately watching different doors, etc.

[Death's Shadow]

glad to hear that you and some others are taking that action Lam.

was talking with wife the other day about the mall shooting in Omaha,
asked her if she thought the outcome would have been the same if there had been armed people there that could protect themselves. I imagine some innocents would still die, but I bet that one of them might have taken him out before he got 8 people. He died in the end anyway by his own hand.

she thought I was a little cold.
I asked her if any of the 8 victims families would have thought that point of view was cold.

She had no response.

DS

[Lamron]

You're right that there would still be some deaths, because someone could probably shoot at least 3 or 4 people before anyone could react at all. But there is no excuses for these incidents where the death count is 20-30+ people. In as much time as that takes, somebody (armed or not) should have done something. It may not be possible to completely prevent these kinds of attacks, but we should be able to drastically cut down on the death count.

[I...Died...Again!!!]

“Dueling Banjoes played in the back ground” Even in Georgia we can’t (shouldn’t) carry at a Church or church function.

O.C.G.A. § 16-11-127
Carrying deadly weapons to or at public gatherings; affirmative defenses
(a) Except as provided in Code Section 16-11-127.1, a person is guilty of a misdemeanor when he or she carries to or while at a public gathering any explosive compound, firearm, or knife designed for the purpose of offense and defense.

(b) For the purpose of this Code section, "public gathering" shall include, but shall not be limited to, athletic or sporting events, churches or church functions, political rallies or functions, publicly owned or operated buildings, or establishments at which alcoholic beverages are sold for consumption on the premises. Nothing in this Code section shall otherwise prohibit the carrying of a firearm in any other public place by a person licensed or permitted to carry such firearm by this part.

(c) This Code section shall not apply to competitors participating in organized sport shooting events. Law enforcement officers, peace officers retired from state or federal law enforcement agencies, judges, magistrates, solicitors-general, and district attorneys may carry pistols in publicly owned or operated buildings.

(d) It is an affirmative defense to a violation of this Code section if a person notifies a law enforcement officer or other person employed to provide security for a public gathering of the presence of such item as soon as possible after learning of its presence and surrenders or secures such item as directed by the law enforcement officer or other person employed to provide security for a public gathering.

Lam I am not saying that I disagree with you but for instance here it would be a misdemeanor offense. The largest debate is the one about a piblic building. Some interpret this as places such as the "Mall". On the contrary the mall is private property and unless otherwise posted carry there is authorized.

[Death's Shadow]

misdemeanor offense it may be.. but at least I would have the option of protecting my family, myself and others..

Id gladly accept the charges if it meant that innocents were not slaughtered.

I hope nothing like this ever happens, but those that are prepared have a much better chance at survival.

[vinsanity]

I agree that I would take a misdemeanor charge versus the possible alternative. I see it as one of those situations in which arguing the point after the fact would be the best way to go.

[I...Died...Again!!!]

Better to begg for forgiveness than to ask for permition! Every married man knows that!

[RedRock]

I haven't looked it up, but I think Florida's carry permit is the same--no on church, etc. And didn't Slick Willie issue an executive order, or was it a law passed under his watch, making it a felony to have a firearm (including otherwise legally owned and carried, including just in the glove compartment of your car) within 1000 feet of a school? I can't chance a felony, because a felony conviction would deprive me of the right to practice medicine in the USA. And you guys need to be aware too that any "domestic abuse" on your part of a spouse/family member means that you lose your right to keep and bear arms under current laws/rulings (don't plead guilty to it, even if it's a misdemeanor). At least this is what I have read in the past--sorry, no time to look it up further now. Also, in Florida, we recently tried and failed (I hope we try again) to prevent employers from being able to say employees can't have a gun in their car if they park or travel on (private!) company property.

[Lamron]

I did some checking on Florida, and I don't see any prohibition on church carry. If there is an attached school it is arguable whether its "part" of the church, especially on a non-school day. And you can carry on your employers property. Its not a crime, but they can fire you for it.

I...Died...Again!!!, sorry man. Move to a free state!

[BigDaddy]

Most of your small town cops are not going to give you a big hassle about it. I have noticed that it is worse in the big towns like Atlanta and some of the surrounding counties, where it is more Liberal and Democratic.

[Fledermaus]

Here is a quote from the woman who shot and killed the shooter in the church: "I saw him coming through the doors" and took cover, Assam said. "I came out of cover and identified myself and engaged him and took him down."

Now that is my kind of woman!

Here is the link to the newss story: www.thedenverchannel.com/news/14817480/detail.html

[Death's Shadow]

Just saw that story on fox news this morning.. WTG lady.. we need more people like her.

[RedRock]

Yep, she described being ready, moving appropriately, picking the best time and place to confront him (but without undue delay), identifying herself and giving him a chance, and then doing what she obviously believed was necessary and appropriate. She did look shook up but resolute about it. There were what, about 1000 people at church then, and they estimate about 100 might have been wounded or killed if he hadn't been stopped.

[I...Died...Again!!!]

Don't get me wrong GA. is a good state for weapons rights. And I too would risk the misdemeanor charge. I often when out around town go to a restaurant to eat and keep my weapon on me even if there is alcohol there. I am not drinking it. The Georgia law goes on to say that carry at a school is not, hold on.

Kinda getting into the wrong forum for this but here it is.

O.C.G.A. § 16-11-127.1
Carrying weapons within school safety zones, at school functions, or on school
property
(a) As used in this Code section, the term:
(1) "School safety zone" means in, on, or within 1,000 feet of any real property owned
by or leased to any public or private elementary school, secondary school, or school
board and used for elementary or secondary education and in, on, or within 1,000 feet of
the campus of any public or private technical school, vocational school, college,
university, or institution of postsecondary education.

(c) The provisions of this Code section shall not apply to:
(1) Baseball bats, hockey sticks, or other sports equipment possessed by competitors for
legitimate athletic purposes;
(2) Participants in organized sport shooting events or firearm training courses;
(5) The following persons, when acting in the performance of their official duties or
when en route to or from their official duties:

(F) Medical examiners, coroners, and their investigators who are employed by the
state or any political subdivision thereof;
19
7) A person who is licensed in accordance with Code Section 16-11-129 or issued a
permit pursuant to Code Section 43-38-10, when such person carries or picks up a student
at a school building, school function, or school property or on a bus or other
transportation furnished by the school or any weapon legally kept within a vehicle in
transit through a designated school zone by any person other than a student;
(8) A weapon which is in a locked compartment of a motor vehicle or one which is in a
locked container in or a locked firearms rack which is on a motor vehicle which is being
used by an adult over 21 years of age to bring to or pick up a student at a school building,
school function, or school property or on a bus or other transportation furnished by the
school, or when such vehicle is used to transport someone to an activity being conducted
on school property which has been authorized by a duly authorized official of the school;
provided, however, that this exception shall not apply to a student attending such school;


This informatin from: legallyarmed.com/resources/galaws1.pdf

red I dont know if (F) above would apply to you but it could be worth looking up.

Also check your states reciprocity agreement, her is GA's. 21 states not too shabby.
law.ga.gov/00/press/detail/0,2668,87670814_88140684_88298626,00.html

[RedRock]

This whole thread might better be in the RKBA section?

This video, re: OH CCW, is pertinent in regard to these recent public location shootings: www.liveleak.com/view?i=b09_1193559395